Doug M Wrote:
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> Complaints about theosophists and whatever axes
> they have to grind with Egyptology are not my
> concern.
But they are your concern when KGG demonstrates that you're using them to support your claims! If you're going to quote obsolete sources or sources that are far outside the mainstream of Egyptology you had better justify your position for using them.
>
> The reference to the pyramid texts is relevant
> because such images of Djehuti are part of the
> tradition of symbolism and kingship that
> originated in the Old Kingdom. Specifically, the
> symbolism of the snakes wearing crowns as signs of
> royal and magical power are relevant and the
> pyramid texts reflects the Egyptian belief on the
> subject.
>
> Whether the scepter touches the mouth of the
> pharoah or not or whether they convey power to the
> pharoah in this particular scene or not is not my
> issue. The issue is whether the scepters carried
> by Djehuti and the snakes around them are symbols
> of the "magic" power of state. Crowns always
> symbolize kingship and are inherently political.
> Therefore, as per the earlier sub thread, this is
> an example where magic and politics are mixed.
>
> I don't agree with you that the following passage
> in the PTs:
Quote:
> Ho crown of Lower Egypt! Ho red-crown! Ho Great
> Crown! Ho Crown great of magic! Ho Fiery Serpent!
>
>
> Are not relevant to the symbolic imagery of the
> serpents wearing the crowns of upper and lower
> Egypt no longer being symbols of magical power
> because they appear around the staff of Djehuti.
> That to me sounds quite odd. Especially
> considering other vignettes from tombs such as
> that in the tomb of Amenhotep III, where these
> snakes are shown as independent entities wearing
> the crowns of Upper and Lower Egypt. A good
> picture of this scene is in the current edition of
> Kmt Magazine. So, to me, the Egyptians themselves
> seem to represent these snakes pictorially and in
> writing as being symbols of magical power and
> kingship.
>
> No offense, but on these subtle symbolic issues,
> the only references I find meaningful are primary
> texts and images from Egypt proper.
It seems to me that you've painted yourself in a corner then. I agree we all should refer to the primary texts (something that I applaud and and every historian should practice BTW ) But sooner or later you have to interpret those primary texts. If you don't all we'll have is primary texts and everybody's unpublished thoughts on them. As far as the PT's goes anybody that cherrypicks a verse here and a verse there to support their own pet theory isn't going to get very far in their studies.
All those I
> have seen so far, indicate that these serpents
> wearing the crown of Upper and Lower Egypt
> respectively were symbols of magical and kingly
> power and that the meanings did not change from
> the pyramid text passage I cited to the one image
> in Seti's temple.
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> Edited 1 times. Last edit at 08/19/07 03:47PM by
> Doug M.