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April 27, 2024, 3:42 pm UTC    
December 13, 2007 02:58PM
Hi MJ,

That the division of the cubit into 7 palms and each palm divided into 4 fingers, was probably derived from the forearm, hand, and the four fingers of the hand, is indicated by the determinative for cubit (mH), the D42 sign, 'forearm with palm down'. The 'palm' (Szp) unit was about 75 mm - approximately the width across the knuckles of the 4 fingers of the hand, and each 'finger' unit, about 19mm, about the average width of a finger across the knuckle - the 'finger' unit (Dba, 1/28th of a cubit) was written with the ideogram for 'finger', D50.

28 fingers in a cubit, is a consequence of the human hand having 4 fingers. Once the length from about the elbow to the tip of the middle finger was accepted as a standard unit of length, and this was then divided up into the nearest number of whole palms, it came to within a few centimetres, 7 palms - and 7 x 4 = 28.

Nature did not 'design' the forearm / hand to be exactly 7 palms, but that's nature for you. The AE had a similar problem with the year - they divided up the year into twelve 30 day months that came to 360 days. However the year has 365 days so they simply added on another 5 days. Even that was not enough to create a calendar that kept in time with the seasons as the solar year is actually 365.25 days long so their 'civil' calendar 'wandered'. Even their 30 month was an idealized month as the average length of the month is 29.53 days and 12 x 29.53 = a 354.36 day lunar 'year', which is 11 days shorter than the 365.25 day solar year.


The cubit may be also related to the lunar cycle - four phases of the moon were named by the ancient Egyptians - smdt (full moon, half month festival), snt (first quarter, 6th day festival), psDtyw (new moon), dnit (last quarter).

Month (Abd), was written with a combination of N11 (crescent moon) and N14 (five-pointed star), and 'half-month' with half crescent moon sign N11, and N14 (five-pointed star) - the rising of certain stars and the phases of the moon were both used for the timing of sacred rituals.


The 'palm' (Szp, 1/7th of a cubit) could be written simply with what appears to be N11, the 'crescent moon', an abbreviation of O42 (Szp) Q3 (p) + determinative N11 ('crescent moon').

The use of the crescent moon sign for 'palm' suggests an association with the lunar cycle.


The name of Thoth (DHwty) was written with the 'sacred ibis on standard' sign, G26. The long curved beak of the ibis is reminiscent of the shape of the crescent moon. Seshat the female scribe had a crescent moon-like symbol over her head as part of her headdress. Both Thoth and Seshat had a role to play in the reconstitution of the king, with scribal tasks, numbering, timekeeping and building. Both Thoth and Seshat are attested apparently from the early dynastic period and certainly early in Dyn 4.

CT
Subject Author Posted

Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 04, 2007 08:32PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 04, 2007 08:35PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 04, 2007 10:28PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

C Wayne Taylor December 05, 2007 06:10AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 05, 2007 04:19PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 05, 2007 07:22AM

Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 08:25AM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 05, 2007 04:26PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 04:42PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 05, 2007 04:48PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

L Cooper December 05, 2007 05:52PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 05, 2007 10:19PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

L Cooper December 06, 2007 06:47AM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 06, 2007 11:18PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Greg Reeder December 07, 2007 12:33PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

L Cooper December 09, 2007 08:27PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 11, 2007 08:49PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

fmetrol December 05, 2007 05:10PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 05:19PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 05:22PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

fmetrol December 05, 2007 05:30PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 06:13PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

fmetrol December 06, 2007 06:06PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 05, 2007 05:25PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

fmetrol December 05, 2007 05:36PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Dave L December 05, 2007 06:20PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

fmetrol December 05, 2007 06:47PM

Re: Edit of last post after time-out

Clive December 05, 2007 10:22PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Kanga December 06, 2007 09:37AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 06, 2007 10:07PM

Re: Another simple question

Anthony December 04, 2007 09:07PM

Re: Another simple question

Clive December 04, 2007 11:25PM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 05, 2007 02:28AM

Re: Another simple question

Clive December 05, 2007 04:38PM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 05, 2007 11:51PM

Re: Another simple question

Clive December 06, 2007 01:48AM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 06, 2007 09:28PM

Re: Another simple question

Clive December 06, 2007 10:45PM

Re: Another simple question

Dave L December 07, 2007 06:42AM

Re: Another simple question

Dave L December 06, 2007 10:07AM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 06, 2007 10:29PM

Re: Another simple question

Dave L December 09, 2007 04:54PM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 11, 2007 06:45PM

Re: Another simple question

Sirfiroth December 05, 2007 12:31AM

Another simple question for the "pros"

C Wayne Taylor December 05, 2007 06:20AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

cladking December 04, 2007 09:18PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 04, 2007 11:31PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 05, 2007 10:08AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

MJ Thomas December 05, 2007 03:33AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 05, 2007 04:45PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 05, 2007 04:51PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 05, 2007 05:04PM

Simple answer...

Morph December 05, 2007 06:22AM

Re: Simple answer...

fmetrol December 05, 2007 06:40AM

Re: Simple answer...

Morph December 08, 2007 06:31AM

Re: Simple answer...

fmetrol December 08, 2007 07:33AM

Re: Simple answer...

Morph December 08, 2007 08:50AM

Re: Simple answer...

Clive December 11, 2007 07:04PM

Re: Simple answer...

Jammer December 05, 2007 10:19AM

Re: Simple answer...

MJ Thomas December 05, 2007 12:30PM

Re: Simple answer...

Jammer December 05, 2007 03:22PM

Re: Simple answer...

MJ Thomas December 05, 2007 03:25PM

Re: Simple answer...

Dave L December 05, 2007 03:45PM

Re: Simple answer...

Kanga December 06, 2007 09:51AM

Important point

Anthony December 06, 2007 01:28PM

Re: Important point

MJ Thomas December 06, 2007 06:17PM

Re: Important point

fmetrol December 06, 2007 06:39PM

Re: Important point

MJ Thomas December 06, 2007 06:59PM

Re: Important point

Kanga December 06, 2007 07:51PM

Re: Important point

fmetrol December 06, 2007 08:37PM

Re: Important point

Pistol December 07, 2007 12:34AM

Re: Important point

fmetrol December 07, 2007 03:30AM

The 7 part cubit was the standard

Dave L December 06, 2007 08:53PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

fmetrol December 06, 2007 09:09PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Dave L December 07, 2007 06:38AM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

fmetrol December 07, 2007 08:08AM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Dave L December 09, 2007 04:57PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Jammer December 07, 2007 01:33PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Warwick L Nixon December 07, 2007 01:37PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Jammer December 07, 2007 01:41PM

Re: The 7 part cubit was the standard

Warwick L Nixon December 07, 2007 01:55PM

Re: Important point

Clive December 06, 2007 09:51PM

Re: Important point

Greg Reeder December 07, 2007 12:31PM

Re: Important point

Clive December 11, 2007 07:12PM

Re: Important point

Kanga December 11, 2007 08:04PM

Layering speculations

Anthony December 11, 2007 08:10PM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 11, 2007 08:26PM

Re: Layering speculations

Anthony December 11, 2007 09:44PM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 11, 2007 08:30PM

Re: Layering speculations

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Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 11, 2007 10:26PM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 12, 2007 12:23AM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 12, 2007 01:00AM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 12, 2007 06:00PM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 12, 2007 08:01PM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 12, 2007 10:22PM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 12, 2007 11:06PM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 12, 2007 11:57PM

Re: Layering speculations

MJ Thomas December 12, 2007 11:24PM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 12, 2007 11:37PM

Re: Layering speculations

MJ Thomas December 13, 2007 06:29AM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 13, 2007 07:06AM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 13, 2007 09:51AM

Re: Layering speculations

fmetrol December 13, 2007 10:14AM

A question on the evidence...

Anthony December 13, 2007 12:26PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Chris Tedder December 13, 2007 01:00PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Greg Reeder December 13, 2007 04:34PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

C Wayne Taylor December 13, 2007 05:11PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

fmetrol December 13, 2007 09:06PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Chris Tedder December 14, 2007 04:01AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

fmetrol December 14, 2007 06:55AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Greg Reeder December 14, 2007 09:39AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Chris Tedder December 14, 2007 03:22PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Greg Reeder December 14, 2007 04:05PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Chris Tedder December 14, 2007 05:30PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

Anthony December 14, 2007 09:21PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

C Wayne Taylor December 15, 2007 05:34AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

fmetrol December 15, 2007 06:45AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

MJ Thomas December 15, 2007 10:45AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

fmetrol December 15, 2007 11:02AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

MJ Thomas December 15, 2007 01:23PM

Projecting modern thought onto ancient evidence

Anthony December 14, 2007 10:02AM

Re: Projecting modern thought onto ancient evidence

fmetrol December 14, 2007 10:19AM

ROFLMAO

Anthony December 14, 2007 10:27AM

Re: A question on the evidence...

MJ Thomas December 13, 2007 05:58PM

Re: A question on the evidence...

C Wayne Taylor December 14, 2007 05:53AM

Re: Layering speculations

Chris Tedder December 13, 2007 01:51PM

Re: Layering speculations

MJ Thomas December 13, 2007 02:05PM

Re: Layering speculations

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Re: Layering speculations

MJ Thomas December 14, 2007 09:13PM

Re: Layering speculations

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Re: Layering speculations

MJ Thomas December 12, 2007 10:57PM

Re: Layering speculations

Clive December 12, 2007 11:53PM

Re: Layering speculations

Hermione December 12, 2007 04:58AM

Re: Important point

Clive December 11, 2007 08:23PM

Re: Simple answer...

Morph December 08, 2007 06:15AM

Re: Simple answer...

Clive December 11, 2007 08:27PM

Re: Simple answer...

Clive December 05, 2007 05:07PM

Re: Simple answer...

Jammer December 07, 2007 01:45PM

Re: Simple answer...

Clive December 05, 2007 05:02PM

Re: Simple answer...

Greg Reeder December 07, 2007 01:10PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 05, 2007 11:17AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 05, 2007 03:43PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 06, 2007 10:19AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 06, 2007 12:52PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 07, 2007 01:25PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

rich December 05, 2007 03:14PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Pistol December 05, 2007 03:27PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 05, 2007 03:35PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 06, 2007 10:29AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 06, 2007 12:32PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 06, 2007 12:50PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 05, 2007 05:15PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Pistol December 05, 2007 07:50PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 05, 2007 10:31PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Pistol December 06, 2007 11:45AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

MJ Thomas December 06, 2007 06:35PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 06, 2007 11:43PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 07, 2007 01:51PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 11, 2007 08:52PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 11, 2007 09:27PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 12, 2007 12:43AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 12, 2007 09:05AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 12, 2007 09:51AM

Moderation note to sub-thread

Hermione December 12, 2007 10:00AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 12, 2007 11:57AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 12, 2007 06:20PM

Knowledge versus Belief

Anthony December 12, 2007 06:28PM

Re: Knowledge versus Belief

cladking December 12, 2007 07:38PM

Re: Knowledge versus Belief

Anthony December 12, 2007 08:02PM

Re: Knowledge versus Belief

cladking December 12, 2007 08:21PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 12, 2007 07:53PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 14, 2007 08:43AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 14, 2007 11:43AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 14, 2007 11:49AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 14, 2007 01:08PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 14, 2007 01:15PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 14, 2007 01:58PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 14, 2007 02:03PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Jammer December 14, 2007 02:23PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Warwick L Nixon December 14, 2007 02:33PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Kanga December 06, 2007 09:43AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Greg Reeder December 07, 2007 12:38PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 07, 2007 05:33PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Greg Reeder December 07, 2007 05:59PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 07, 2007 06:33PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

L Cooper December 08, 2007 08:08AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Dave L December 09, 2007 04:52PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Greg Reeder December 09, 2007 07:21PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 11, 2007 08:34PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 11, 2007 08:39PM

Whatever...n/t

Clive December 11, 2007 08:50PM

Re: Whatever...n/t

fmetrol December 11, 2007 08:59PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 11, 2007 08:32PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

poundr17 December 08, 2007 04:18PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 08, 2007 06:09PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

David Johnson December 15, 2007 09:43AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 15, 2007 11:36AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

David Johnson December 17, 2007 04:11AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Clive December 17, 2007 06:15PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Chris Tedder December 17, 2007 07:55PM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

Chris Tedder December 17, 2007 06:46AM

Re: Another simple question for the "pros"

fmetrol December 17, 2007 08:47AM

Re: Unrelated concepts

MJ Thomas December 06, 2007 06:28PM

Re: Unrelated concepts

Clive December 06, 2007 09:01PM

Re: Unrelated concepts

MJ Thomas December 07, 2007 09:07AM

Re: Unrelated concepts

Anthony December 06, 2007 09:53PM

Re: Unrelated concepts

L Cooper December 06, 2007 11:51PM

**Moderation note**

Hermione December 07, 2007 10:32AM



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