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May 16, 2024, 11:41 pm UTC    
July 31, 2005 10:58PM
Mihos Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fumihito, A., T. Miyake, S. Sumi, M. Takada, S.
> Ohno and N. Kondo. 1994. One Subspecies of the Red
> Junglefowl (Gallus gallus gallus) Suffices As the
> Matriarchic Ancestor of all Domestic Breeds. Proc.
> Natl. Acad. Sci., 91: 12505-12509.
> Langdon, R. 1989. When the Blue-Egg Chickens Come
> Home to Roost. Journal of Pacific History, 24:
> 164-192.
>
> The domestic fowl that arrived post Conquistador
> are of Meditteranean gene type.
> The Lapita culture's domestic fowl are derived of
> Gallus gallus spadiceus of Burma/Vietnam/Cochin
> China.
> THe domestic fowl of Rapanui and some other
> islands like Pitcairn and Marquesis are
> genetically distinctive. Their RFLP type is
> endemic to Indonesia and derived of Gallus bankiva
> the Javanese
> red jf. All other domestic fowl are believed to be
> derived of the sister species Gallus spadiceus The
> Burmese Red JF.
>
> What is more, the Rapanui and Quechua fowl have
> the nuclear DNA of Gallus varius. They are of
> hybrid ancestry and because of their unique
> genetics are not truly chickens.
>
> These domestic fowl were in Easter ISland when the
> first Europeans arrived.
>
>
> And there were domestic fowl in South America when
> the first Europeans arrived as well.
> In fact, these unique domestic fowl are similar to
> the Rapanui fowl in that they lay blue or green
> eggs. None of the wild red jf produce these
> pigments nor do their domestic progeny.
> Blue green eggs were unknown in Asia or Europe
> before Magellan described them and brought them to
> Europe.
**********
The PNAS paper has nothing to do with these claims. I have not gotten the Journal of Pacific History paper yet but given the date I doubt that it has much genetics in it
. What I believe is the source for some of these claims is the following web page--this is NOT a refereed literature source:




[www.feathersite.com]
The Rapanui is named after the island that is also known as Easter Island. They are also found feral in Pitcairn and Marquesis. Rapanui fowl may be divided into two distinct races introduced and perpetuated by respective ethnic migrations. The Tapu race of Rapanui fowl are melenotic with blue-black skin and a long crow. Moa Tu' A Ivi Raa' (ember yellow-backed) and Moa Tea (grey ashe-hued) are considered to be endemic to Oceania, especially those large islands mentioned above. But these semidomestic fowl were to be introduced to the western coast of South America by Melenesian populations thousands of years before the birth of Polynesian culture. It is believed that the Olmec (earliest known culture of South America) generated the South American stocks and further refined them, a practice taken up by the their succesors, including the Incas.

There are several distinct subraces of this genotype, discussed below. They have been developed for many tens of thousands of years by the Melenesian culture that once inhabited what is now Indonesia, who first migrated to Micronesia and beyond bringing with them their domestic animals. The Tapu race of Rapanui fowl are descended from archaic fighting ruff breeds endemic to Indonesia and Melenesia. These game fowl are the female ancestors of the Tapu race of Rapanui fowl. Many of the original male founders of the Tapu Rapanui fowl were evidentally Ayam Bekisar, a strange Indonesian hybrid between Malay females and Green Junglefowl (Gallus varius) roosters.

The Olmec races are, as their name suggests, endemic to South American highland regions. Rapanui Fowl are endemic to Oceania. Both Peruvian and Chilean Indians were kept as slaves in recent history on Rapanui (Easter Island) and are believed to have reintroduced some of their native stocks of fowl to the islands. Ironic that the original ancestral home of the fowl would end up being a new home for these clearly Olmec refined stocks.

The main races of the Rapanui/Olmec fowl are described below:

1. The Quechua, which may be tailed or rumpless, is a bantam-sized equivalent of the Tapu Rapanui Fowl. Quechua have an abrupt, high pitched multiple syllable crow. This fowl may have a long fifth toe and yellow legs. They may be tufted in stocks mixed with Quetro. Many exhibit a diminutive crest and most will have conservative muffs and/or beards. Greenish-gray eggs are the norm, but some lay spotted pinkish eggs and others a yellowish-tinted egg. They are found on various islands, including Pitcairn, Marquesis, and Easter, and on the mainland in Bolivia and Argentina.

2. Black Quechua Olmec are similar to the typical Quechua but have blue-black skin and bones and black or blue legs (they are the only South American member of this group with characteristic black skin), and produce glossy green eggs or blue eggs. The Black Quechua Olmec is generally rumpless and never has tufts. It is found in Costa Rica, Ecuador and Mexico.

3. Quetro are tiny to moderate-sized bantams with very small wattles and comb. They are remarkable fliers and generally silent. The crow is described as a "laughing crow." These fowl have ear tufts, though the ear tufts of the females are often very small, and very little or no bare facial skin shows. These birds are always tailed. Females tend to be strikingly beautiful, some with dark mahogany breasts and others with pale salmon breasts or wheaten. All female Quetro will exhibit unusual and highly concealing patterns in the wings and hackles. In pattern, the breast of the male is similar to the hackle. The hackle itself is often hair-like and it is not unusual to produce birds with "cowlicks" in the hackles or slightly frizzled individuals. Egg color is highly variable. Some strains usually produce lilac or an intense grey lilac blue. Other strains lay a vivid orange egg, others red ochre and still others lay spotted pink or clear green eggs. They are found only in the Peruvian Highlands and can still be observed on the reed islands of Lake Titicaca. The Quetro is believed to have been a highly sacred animal to the Olmec and some of the subsequent Andean cultures.

4. The last group consists of the Ayam Pelung derived rumpless games and basket fowl like the Wallikiki, Kainga, and Colloncas, several related rumpless or tailed quail bantams with greatly curtailed wattles, generally lacking combs, and often prominently spotted. Females will often closely resemble the females of the Quetro but lack their tufts and tails. Bare facial skin is generally not evident and the legs are willow or dark but never yellow. Muffs and beards are not present nor are crests or tufts though a few will have the irregular sprig of a tuft. These birds are very quiet when compared to Rapanui breeds. Males may be hen feathered. They lay white, off white, tinted, yellowish or dark aqua or grayish tinted round eggs. This group is found in Sri Lanka, Bali, the Solomon Islands, Fiji, Pitcairn, Peru and Chile.

Colloncas (Chilean highlands) and Quetro (Peruvian highlands) are descended from the Rapanui race Pakeke (Seafarer stocks) including the Moa Garahuraju (multiple coloured spots) and Moa Totara (frizzled rumpless bantam).

Colloncas De Artes is the composite breed generated by the crossing of Quetro and Colloncas stocks. In North America, the Colloncas De Artes were refined into heirloom varieties of what we call Araucana. In the U.K., Quechua De Artes, the composite breed generated by the crossing of Quechua bantams with Quetros were exported to Europe during the Falklands dispute period. As a consequence, much of the western and northern European countries' tinted egg breeds are derived from Chilean Indian stock and as such are probably more correctly defined as Chilean Araucanas.

The so-called Americauna appears to be in large part a refined Quechua de Artes without tufts but carrying the brown breasted demes of the Quetro.

Genetically, the Rapanui/Olmec are related closely to Indonesia's archaic game fowl the Ayam Cemani, Ayam Pelung, Ayam Bekisar and Ayam Katai and, tellingly, also to Japan's Koeyoshi Long Crowers. The genetic foundation of these Oceanic breeds appears to be the Indonesian Red Junglefowl, Gallus g. bankiva, which was the ancestor of bankivoid game fowl like the Malay. Melenesian and Indonesian cultures domesticated the Indonesian Red Junglefowl at least twelve hundred years before the cultures of mainland Asia domesticated the Burmese Red Junglefowl, G. g. gallus. In short, two divergent cultures domesticated two different wild subspecies, generating two different lineages of domestic fowl. The Burmese Red Junglefowl arrived as the dominant founder probably due in large part to their promiscuous reproductive strategy which contrasts with that of the monogamous Indonesian Red Junglefowl which is also not as disease resistant as its mainland cousin.

Peruvian ethnozoologists of Japanese extraction are responsible for the conservation and breeding of these ancient fowl. Genetics and morphology suggest that the South American fowl (most commonly known as Araucanas) are descended from these two ancient races of Oceanic fowl.
******

The level of ignorance of the author is revealed by his referral to the Olmec as a South American founding culture and the ancestors of the Incas smiling smiley. These descriptions have nothing to do with genetics and no sources are cited about genetics. The author also points out that South American natives were held as slaves in Easter Island in "recent historical tims" and then "reintroduced"these supposed chickens to South America. Without commenting on the truth or falsity of these ("slaves")-- actually genetic analysis of Easter Island inhabitants shows European genes from the colonial experience NOT native american genes-- the author refutes himself because by Occam's razor it is unnecesaary to postulate pre-Columbian chickens (with zero chicken bones as Katherine has pointed out) for the presence of thee chickens in South America- If, indeed they are present at all. No refereed citation has been provided for this allegation either.
Bernard
Subject Author Posted

Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Doug Weller July 30, 2005 09:37AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

donald raab July 30, 2005 02:30PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Pacal July 30, 2005 03:10PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover July 31, 2005 11:47AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

donald raab July 31, 2005 08:48PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 08:24AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 05:31PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 11:33PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 11:22AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 11:33AM

Moderation Note

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 11:35AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 01:20PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 05:27PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Roxana Cooper August 01, 2005 09:38AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard July 30, 2005 03:04PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos July 30, 2005 09:34PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard July 30, 2005 11:07PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover July 31, 2005 11:33AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos July 31, 2005 03:56PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos July 31, 2005 04:02PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos July 31, 2005 04:08PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover July 31, 2005 05:15PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece July 31, 2005 05:23PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard July 31, 2005 05:28PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Josh August 17, 2005 02:33PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

John Wall August 17, 2005 02:35PM

Moderation Note to Mihos

Katherine Reece July 31, 2005 04:15PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos July 31, 2005 04:46PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece July 31, 2005 05:21PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 08:03AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece August 01, 2005 09:29AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 09:54AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece August 01, 2005 10:33AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 06:59PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece August 01, 2005 07:08PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard August 01, 2005 07:20PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 01, 2005 11:32PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 01:01AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 11:04AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 11:34AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 01:14PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard August 01, 2005 12:49PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 05:34PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 07:00PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover July 31, 2005 05:45PM

Totally irrellevant nonsense.

kenuchelover July 31, 2005 05:28PM

Re: Totally irrellevant nonsense.

Mihos August 01, 2005 08:20AM

Re: Totally irrellevant nonsense.

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 07:57PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard July 31, 2005 10:58PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 01, 2005 07:40PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 12:38AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 12:52AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard August 02, 2005 10:41AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 10:44AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 11:17AM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Mihos August 02, 2005 01:59PM

Whoa!

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 02:07PM

Re: Whoa!

Mihos August 02, 2005 03:07PM

Re: Whoa!

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 03:56PM

Re: Whoa!

Sourial Ma'ahes Amoun August 02, 2005 04:06PM

Re: Whoa!

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 04:09PM

Re: Whoa!

Mihos August 02, 2005 04:16PM

Re: Whoa!

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 04:19PM

Mihos still hasn't a clue, finally admits no credentials & merely half recalls OLD private theory of elderly Japanese researcher.

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 03:45PM

Re: Mihos still hasn't a clue, finally admits no credentials & merely half recalls OLD private theory of elderly Japanese researcher.

Sourial Ma'ahes Amoun August 02, 2005 03:59PM

Mihos.... a word please....

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 04:02PM

\ OLD private theory of elderly Japanese researcher.

Mihos August 02, 2005 04:37PM

Re: Mihos still hasn't a clue, finally admits no credentials & merely half recalls OLD private theory of elderly Japanese researcher.

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 04:48PM

irrelevant

bernard August 02, 2005 03:54PM

Re: irrelevant

Mihos August 02, 2005 04:15PM

Re: irrelevant

bernard August 02, 2005 04:52PM

Re: irrelevant

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 04:59PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 01:08PM

Using people's names in posts

Doug Weller August 02, 2005 01:19PM

Re: Using people's names in posts

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 01:28PM

Re: Using people's names in posts

Mihos August 02, 2005 03:00PM

Re: Using people's names in posts

David Campbell August 02, 2005 04:04PM

Moderation Note

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 04:06PM

Re: Using people's names in posts

kenuchelover August 02, 2005 04:39PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

Hans July 31, 2005 12:38PM

Re: Human Lymphocyte Antigens: Apparent Afro-Asiatic, Southern Asian, & European HLAs in Indigenous American Populations

bernard July 31, 2005 05:27PM

Thread reopened

Katherine Reece August 02, 2005 05:45PM



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