Ritva Kurittu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Graham,
>
> > "Surely the first concerns were the presence
> and
> > absence of light, the sun. Especially the
> absence,
> > since that would have been the most dangerous
> time
> > for the humans and bordering directly to
> their
> > very survival"
> >
> > This is often brought up but I ask ... was
> this a
> > dangerous time for you in childhood or at
> any
> > stage in life?
>
>
>
> I think you are missing a point of importance, and
> that is the time when the basic beliefs (in this
> case seen in the ancient Egypt) were formed.
> Surely you don't believe that the AEs sat down at
> the beginning of the dynastic times and decided
> what to believe in? That is not the way belief
> systems are formed. The beliefs are passed down
> from generation to generation orally, sine no
> other means of recording were available, to be
> finally written down and recorded in one form or
> another. Of course, the beliefs are modified on
> the way to better reflect the culture and it's
> internal changes, such as "scientific"
> understanding of certain natural phenomena, or
> even personal preferences of a certain dynasty.
> Still, the basic beliefs hark to the time unknown
> and forgotten by the people in question.
> Hence, comparing me and my beliefs/fears, based on
> modern knowledge and scientific understanding of
> the phenomena in question, to the ancient
> Egyptians is a red herring. A very red one at
> that.

You keep telling me I am missing the point.
What point?

Nowhere to my knowledge have I said anything about instant belief systems. I merely pointed out there is nothing dangerous about the sun setting, either now, 5000 years ago or 20000 years ago. It has nothing to do with our scientific understanding for regardless of anyone's beliefs Re always re-emerges in the morning and nothing prevents it. For the AE neither flood, famine or the death of pharaoh prevented it. This was known and accepted. Sure they had explanations and stories about the cycle of Re but how in the hell could the presence or absence of light be thought of as dangerous or threatening to their survival. As far as anyone could remember the cycle of light and dark had always occurred and couldn't be stopped.


> > The sun comes up with monotonous regularity
> and
> > even the Egyptians knew that. No one cowers
> in
> > fear when Re sets, they just look up at the
> stars.
> > The presence or absence of light may have
> > threatened their survival but it never
> happened
> > unexpectedly, except during eclipses and even
> that
> > may have been predicted.
>
> Yes, the ancient Egyptians saw the sun come up
> each morning with "monotonous regularity". And
> yet, their texts talk about the danger of the sun
> being swallowed by Apep during the night. Each
> night. And hence the need of the stars to drag the
> sun's boat through the dwat and even the need of
> Seth at the brow of that boat, him being the only
> one strong enough to fight back Apep. Note well:
> fight back, not kill. Because Apep was there again
> the next night! And these texts remains
> practically the same throughout the dynastic
> times. Hmmmm?
> Transposing your own knowledge and beliefs on the
> ancient ones can be very, very misleading,
> Graham.

Now here is where you missed the point.
Asking whether you ever felt threatened is not transposing my knowledge and beliefs back on to the AE's. It's merely asking you to think about what you said. I didn't ask for a summary of their colorful stories regards Apep or any other explanation of Re's cycle. What I did ask for was a little more thought about what you wrote:

> "Surely the first concerns were the presence and
> absence of light, the sun. Especially the absence,
> since that would have been the most dangerous time
> for the humans and bordering directly to their
> very survival"

Nothing dangerous at all,
It cannot be stopped and they knew it.

Graham