Dave L Wrote:
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> What do Scythians speak?

Scythian?

[...] The vast majority of scholars agree that the Scythian-Sarmatian languages (and Ossetic) belong to the North Eastern branch of the Iranian language family like the once widespread but now extinct Sogdian language. The main argument of the Iranian hypothesis is the fact that the Greek inscriptions of the Northern Black Sea Coast contain several hundreds Sarmatian names showing a close affinity to the Ossetic language.

A competing theory claims that the Scythians spoke a Turkic language. The theory was more popular in the 19th century but has become marginalised during the 20th century [...].

From [www.answers.com]

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Personally, I must admit that the idea that the Picts might have originated in Scythia doesn’t hold a great deal of interest for me. I’m afraid I can’t see it myself, so don’t really want to get into an extended discussion about something I don’t find particularly plausible to start with.

Without admittedly having given this a great deal of thought, my reasoning (based on some of the information in this thread alone) goes something like this:

1) The earliest recorded reference to the Picts dates to the late 3rd century CE (297 to be precise). In this document, the Picti and Hiberni (Irish) are described as being accustomed to fighting the Britanni (Britons). Nothing unusual about this. Also, nothing to suggest that the Picts are new arrivals and/or of non-indigenous origin. Absence of evidence and all of that, but nevertheless ...

2) The suggestion that the Picts are of non-indigenous origin is first recorded in Bede's Historia Ecclesiastica Gentis Anglorum (Ecclesiastical History of the English People) believed to have been completed in the mid-8th century CE (731 to be precise). To quote Aitchison: "According to Bede, 'Pictish seafarers' sailed from Scythia 'in a few longships', arriving first in Ireland before settling in northern Britain." This suggestion of a non-indigenous origin comes over 400 years (434 to be precise) after the first recorded reference to the Picts mentioned above.

3) Ritva mentioned the Declaration of Arbroath in which the Scots are described as having journeyed from Greater Scythia. According to the Declaration, the Scots "journeyed from Greater Scythia by way of the Tyrrhenian Sea and the Pillars of Hercules, and dwelt for a long course of time in Spain among the most savage tribes, but nowhere could they be subdued by any race, however barbarous." The Declaration was written in the 14th century CE (1320 to be precise). This is almost 600 years (589 to be precise) after Bede first suggested that 'Pictish seafarers' sailed from Scythia 'in a few longships', and over 1000 years (1023 to be precise) since the earliest recorded reference to the Picts.

So we have Bede claiming that the Picts sailed from Scythia "in a few longships", and we have the Declaration of Arbroath claiming that the Scots "journeyed from Greater Scythia by way of the Tyrrhenian Sea and the Pillars of Hercules", before hanging out in Spain "for a long course of time".

According to the information in Aitchison’s book, both the Picts and Scots possessed the necessary maritime skill and technology to launch both short- and long-range naval expeditions. There are records of Pictish and Scottish naval expeditions against Orkney, the Hebrides, the north-east coast of Ireland and the Isle of Man. The longest naval expedition recorded suggests that the Picts were capable of launching a raid from Orkney to the Bristol Channel (a round voyage of approximately 1300 miles).

My question is this: given the alleged Scythian origins of the Picts, presumably the Scythians possessed an impressive maritime tradition as well? This must be recorded somewhere, surely? If so, I seem to have missed it somewhere along the way. I was under the impression that the Scythians were more famous for being nomadic horsemen and women than for being seafaring explorers or marauders.

What else were they were known for? Riding into battle armed with bows and arrows, perhaps? As for the Picts, here's what Aitchison (The Picts and the Scots at War) has to say: "Evidence for archaeology in Scotland begins remarkably early, with a surviving bow dated to c.3800 BC. But there is little evidence of archery among the Picts and Scots [...]" (p. 62).

That aside, the Scythians are also justifiably famous for the elaborate array of grave goods (weapons, jewellery, and the like) that periodically turn up in the archaeological record.

As far as the Picts are concerned, here's Nick Aitchison on the subject of grave goods:

"[...] In marked contrast to Anglo-Saxon mortuary practices, the Picts and Scots do not appear to have buried their dead with grave goods. There is no Pictish or Scottish equivalent of Sutton Hoo, the Anglo-Saxon royal ship-burial in East Anglia with its spectacularly rich grave goods. Moreover, with only one possible exception, there are no Pictish or Scottish parallels to the many more mundane, but still highly informative, Anglo-Saxon weapon burials [...]" (p. 44).

Nearly all surviving examples of Pictish art are known through stone sculptures (ie. symbol-stones) generally dated from the 5th to the 9th centuries CE. To my mind, comparing fairly superficial resemblances between examples of Pictish and Scythian art tends to ignore the fairly significant fact that these two traditions are separated both geographically and temporally (the heyday of the Scythians being generally dated from the 8th to the 4th centuries BCE). More plausible comparisons with Pictish art are more likely to be found closer to home among neighbouring Celts and Norse.

Damian








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My dear sir, in this world it is not so easy to settle these plain things. I have ever found your plain things the knottiest of all.

- Moby-Dick by Herman Melville

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'I am beginning to believe that nothing is quite so uncertain as facts.

- Edward S. Curtis

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'We are coming now rather into the region of guesswork', said Dr Mortimer.
'Say, rather, into the region where we balance probabilities and choose the most likely. It is the scientific use of the imagination, but we have always some material basis on which to start our speculation', [replied Holmes].

- The Hound of the Baskervilles by Arthur Conan Doyle

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'It never does to be too sure, you know, in these matters. Coincidence killed the professor.'

- "Novel of the Black Seal" by Arthur Machen