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I appreciate your interest. This is a couple hour job so I'd like to put it off at least until I'm better acquainted with this site. A quick overview though is that water emerged at many points between Lake Moeris and just north of the Giza plateau for many hundreds of thousands of years. At Giza this flow was quite remarkable. Early man used the water for their convenieby cladking - Ancient History
The evidence is there. Candlewax formations. (as location for pyramids) Air tight chambers and passages. Tunneling through existing structure under grand gallery. Weathering on Sphinx. Great step in lower distribution node. Carved candlewax formations and ditches. Use for "proto-pulleys". (explanation for location) Shape and direction of quarry at Giza. Condition of undergby cladking - Ancient History
>"Second, you are never going to find a "silver bullet" that destroys your theory unless your theory has very specific parameters that can be predicted... and then annihilated by contradictory evidence. Do you have such specific predictions?" Numerous ones. Indeed, just a thourough examination of the surronding terrain and ancillary structures could entirely deflateby cladking - Ancient History
>"First, don't go into it looking for proof of your "theory". Look for disproof. You'll get yourself on the right track a lot faster." This is very sound advice and I'll admit I've done it less than I could. But, to date, it just feels like a jigsaw coming together.by cladking - Ancient History
inreference to the height of the grotto you wrote; >"Why does it have to be explained away? Why can't it just "be"? Sometimes, when you're digging a hole in limestone, you discover a hole in the limestone. They are a sedimentary rock, you know... " The grotto is at a higher level than the base of the pyramid. This area is living stone so there is a hillby cladking - Ancient History
>"that requires knowledge of the prevailing winds at the time We haven't got even a hack meteorologist in the group ttbomk, but it can't be too hard to find out." I'm a hack at most everything scientific. I don't think you are following my reasoning here or perhaps my assumptions, since this is an inarguable point. More data could come to light toby cladking - Ancient History
>"Thank you for the reference. However, I still don't think it's anything but windblown sand that got stuck behind the walls." The queens chamber (lower distribution node) is some 260' above sea level and 150' higher than the highest Nile flood in this area. If there were a flood to this level all the inhabitants would have drowned. To be deposited naby cladking - Ancient History
From Khfre's pyramid it would appear that the stones were removed from the bottom up. It might have been the danger of removal which actually halted the work since it seems improbable that there need was sated with so little left. This is one of the reasons that it also seems most im- probable that the channels in the center were worn by the removal of the casing. Additionally whyby cladking - Ancient History
There is a short section of the descending passage which is natural. Surely their route didn't intersect this merely by accident. Perhaps they were generally following a natural cave and simply had to run through it for a short distance.by cladking - Ancient History
>"Thank you for the reference. However, I still don't think it's anything but windblown sand that got stuck behind the walls." If it's really chemically different then it is entirely impossible that it is naturally occurring. It would require that the wind selectively carry this sand far from its origin. Perhaps the case that it's physically and chemicallby cladking - Ancient History
You're likely correct that the samples were obtained from the outside of the pyramid for radio-carbon testing in which case you'd be right that they have no bearing on my contention. Finding detailed information has proven exceedingly difficult for me. And you may well be right about the Red Pyramid as well. I haven't seen anything here except a short video that was relatiby cladking - Ancient History
Further evidence of the existence of a structure preceding the Great Pyramid is the radio-carbon evidence. This has been done a couple times and they get two separate results which are a few hundred years apart. There is precedent for this in the Red Pyramid; There are inter- nal components which not only show weathering but appear to be much older than the rest of the structure.by cladking - Ancient History
They drilled holes into the wall of the chamber many years ago and found the sand. I believe it was in the late '70's. If it's true that it's chemically different then the sand had to have been brought in intentionally or accidently. Finding foreign sand here from natural causes is just a little more improbable than walking into a vacuum because all the air molecules juby cladking - Ancient History
"You're finding correlations, not evidence. When you study the culture, you'll find nothing to support the hydraulic theories for pyramid construction. When you closely study the physical structures, you'll also find it's not viable, either." This is exactly the kind of evidence I seek but has not been forthcoming. "We're talking about an arby cladking - Ancient History
"tho in a sense I sympathise agree with Marc's wish. Personally, the visable lack of any evidence of the higher technology that most of us would draw on in attempting to duplicate the construction of a pyramid, does not, for me preclude the possiblity of it having been done through sheer Hard labour. Neither does it in any way shape of form preclude my appreciation for how importantby cladking - Ancient History
"The surface of the lower courses of Khufu's pyramid was originally painted. Chemical surveys done in the 1960's have shown this to be a fact." I love little tidbits like this. Thankyou. "In what field? Egyptology? Then he's a layman, an amateur, when it comes to Egypt. Sorry, but that's a fact." Professionals have no stranglehold on theby cladking - Ancient History
My statement; > It always comes back to the sand around the lower dis- > tribution node. This sand came from some other area. It > is insane to believe they intentionally imported sand to > a desert. The implication is that it wasunintentionally > imported and probablt water bourne. You answered; "Flood." My response; No. This is an impossibilitby cladking - Ancient History
The water had sufficient pressure to rise to the top of the original step pyramid on this site. This pyramid essentially served as a well- head. The very top of it is at the bottom of the grand gallery and the entrance to the lower distribution node from which it was channeled in- to the various ditches leading to the counterweights. This water was still being used for irrigation so woulby cladking - Ancient History
There is at least one N/S cavern in one of the other sites. I belive at Dashur. It has partially collapsed and is partially man-made. There have been numerous caverns and voids found under Giza. Most of these have not been explored. Even the pit in the underground chamber has been full of rubble for hundreds of years. No one seems to know whats under it. It's highly improbableby cladking - Ancient History
Even simple construction will incorporate some fairly advanced math if you have it at your disposal. If it's not at your disposal then there can be very great incongruities in the finished product. Sir Isaac Newton studied these structure and believed there was something to the math. This was the man who invented the calculus and stood on the shoulders' of giants. Perhaps more is beby cladking - Ancient History
I, personnaly am a little dubious about the claim largely because it seems that if this were true then it would be obviously true and the evidence would be overwhelming. However it does seem to dovetail extremely well with the water theory. The discovery of the means to make this cement can be explained by their observation of the conditions which led to greater accretion of the sta- lby cladking - Ancient History
"You write, 'Levering is out due to the extreme danger and the extremely slow rate at which they would move.' I don't imagine for one moment that the AEs had what we today know and love as 'Health & Safety' Even for us with all our high-tech construction technology and equipment, building the GP would be a high-risk business. Levering heavy blocks of sby cladking - Ancient History
It has been suggested by some sources that the cladding actually fell off in an earthquake. More was taken off to rebuild the near- by areas so it could well be a staging area or even an attempt to find the king's actual burial chamber or a path to it. The cladding was reported to have been inscribed with enough mark- ings to fill 10,000 sheets of papyrus. Today none of these marby cladking - Ancient History
Well organized teamwork is a given for a project of this scope and precision by an ancient people. Brute force is an impossibility. They could not bring enough effort to bear in so small an area using muscle alone. Levering is out due to the extreme danger and the extremely slow rate at which they would move. All the evidence points to water. How else to explain the weathering?by cladking - Ancient History
We could except that we are a very curious animal and the ancients left very few clues. The clues they left all seem to point to water. The pyramids were a water source and were some were probably built using its weight as the chief source of work. If this is true then it will shine a great deal of light not only on the pyramids and their construction but also on the reason for theirby cladking - Ancient History
Thank you very much. This is a logical assumption and is similar to what was my working hypothesis for a long time. I gave this up because of their location and because it was apparent the main ropes were not treated this way so it seemed improbable the more minor ones would be. This is mere conjecture so it's entirely possible he's right and I'm wrong. Thereby cladking - Ancient History
I'd be interested to know how he believes the protopulleys were used.by cladking - Ancient History
Thank you. I'm not sure what you mean by a cubic foot of air displacing 60Lbs of something. A cubic foot of water weighs about 60 Lbs. so perhaps this is your intent, The ancients were probably quite knowledgeable about hydraulics and certainly were well acquainted with math and geometry. The causeways were quite possibly a series of locks which were used to float the stonesby cladking - Ancient History
I should point out that intact "proto-pulleys" aren't known because these would be reused once they reached the base of the pyramid. Even those with broken pegs could be repaired but the whole assembly could be thrown some distance if the peg broke and it would be lost.by cladking - Ancient History
Counterweights can be simple enough devices. They can be as simple as a container at the back of the pyramid tied to a sled containing stones on the front. As water is added to the container it will be- come sufficiently to fall and lift the stones. I believe most of the work was done from the north side and employed three counterweights. The primary lifter was in the center and waby cladking - Ancient History